Brainstorming
From the Brainstorming Doc (July 13, 2013). Worldsingers, Inc. — Godhood and You If you’re here, the means you’ve successfully passed through the red door and accepted Fate’s plan for you. Feel free to mold as you see fit, but be warned: there are other gods who will smite you without mercy should you trample on their land. You have been warned. Guidelines for discussion: 1) Be open to new ideas and willing to accept criticism. 2) Be polite. If you can't say something nicely, don't say it at all. 3) Stay on topic. Let us begin. Our Purpose * To create a world for others to use and enjoy * To learn how to create a well-rounded world. * To have fun, but not at the expense of others. Our Principles * Keep to the tone and canon of the world. - what is “canon” is determined by a simple majority of those it affects. * Worldbuild while aiming to provide room and resource for creativity, making a setting that will have plenty of stuff to explore in additional material. * Disruptive content or members will be removed or altered. - what is considered “disruptive” is determined by at least half of the current participants * Membership is determined by a demonstrated willingness to abide by the rules. After twelve (12) members join in this fashion, others who wish to join can make submissions with the consent of a current member, who shall act as their sponsor until such time as the applicant is deemed by his or her sponsor to be ready and needed. Votes will be tallied by IRC and put into a Google Document until Kazune create a system fit for purpose, where votes are tallied and not made public until the poll closes. Outcome Envisioning We are trying to create, primarily, a Wiki about our invented setting, explaining to a reasonable degree of completeness the basics of the larger surroundings, its cosmology and history, with some depth given to a single continent, its countries, organizations, culture, flora, fauna, et al. BRAINSTORM Go crazy. General: Doseux - We could go with a fantasy planet invaded by sci-fi colonists. *** TheNumber25 - World with a severe disparity between magic in different “zones” — some are high-magic, with the setting itself outright defying normal laws of reality, others with low or even null magic, and different laws. A SF/technology themed zone can be extremely prominent. *** DP - Low Fantasy. Magic, rare and awe-inspiring. Empires. Political intrigue. *** WB - Strange creatures and landscapes. Magic used in ways almost akin to high science like this bit —GV (perhaps with some form of “portalization” to link separate worlds together?) Magic that can be learnt and allows flexibility in individuals. Lost history, perhaps an old war that has splintered the world and allows this air of suspicion and separation to exist. Consideration for races that are not bound to human understanding or limitations, but must still operate by some form of basic rules. *** Golden Vision: IF SciFi— Pangalactic/pansolar civilization, with at least 2-3 alien contacts///IF Fantasy— single magical “art” (not a system) with its possibilities abused to the highest degree (i.e. using magical kung-fu as an electricity generator, etc); strange, ancient creatures, but no “lost golden age” BS. THIS is the (or “a”) Golden Age—but you’ve got Cthulhu on your front door (or something; GoT political plots can work too). Little to no religion significance in religion, not necessarily everywhere, but in some parts. Whether there are actual gods or not can be left open to interpretation (especially if we include some form of magic). —Dos, but spirituality/pantheism is cool. *** Bleeding Raindrops—I don’t have anything to add to the above, although I most agree with WB and 25. I’ll be typing in orange. *** This probably goes in th elast section instead of the first, but it’s too important--the last section should have gone before this one. Worldsingers needs an objective. You ever see people talk about their OCs in /fic/ threads, when they aren’t actually writing a fanfic about said OC; they just like to self-insert wank about their ponysonas? Don’t those people look stupid? Well, that’s what we’re doing if we don’t come right out of the gate knowing why someone would want to read and/or use Worldsingers. We are creating an OC for no reason. A lot of people were talking about “tone” in the last section, and I realized that writing the rest of this bullshit without having “tone” in the front of our heads is stupid. Are we telling high-adventure stories? That seems to be the norm with things like this. Do we want to tell LOTR-style epics where the character visit exotic locations and learn about cool history shit? Do we mostly want the battles and dungeon crawling from LOTR? Do we want the tense “cold war” atmosphere like someone else said? Or do we want some kind of happy pony world? These obviously aren’t mutually exclusive, but discussion here might help to guide the rest. The most important thing a holistic vision; an idea, a theme, a point to make, that absolutely everything clicks into. Going all-in with soul magic and the oversoul and making everything come back to that is one example. Or perhaps a Warhammer idea where everyone hates everyone, and each faction lives in a box, outside of which are the scary aliens who exist only to be enslaved and genocided. Something--an overarching idea that drives everything from culture to geology. My opinion--okay, no, it’s not an opinion, I’m right, so y’all shut up and listen to this--we need to agree on this before we write anything else. We cannot throw out random ideas when we don’t know what kind of ideas are actually going to have a chance of being helpful. Even those ideas that do stick would have been better if we had an idea of tone before throwing them. Ideas about technology vs. magic, which is what everyone else is talking about here, also matter as far as something driving everything else. I’ve always liked the idea of taking magic and doing science to it. There’s probably a published RPG somewhere out there that runs with this idea in ways that a scrub like me can’t, but what I think of is Shadowrun. While Shadowrun is supposed to be gritty cyberpunk, I personally tend to run it like an action blockbuster. Also, it has magic. So you have security guards with astral vision, and the mage on your team has to defeat wards and summoned spirits. This is only one way in which Shadowrun takes magic and makes it part of modern, rational, coprorate/consumer culture. You can buy brand name fetishes, hire magic contractors, and deal in sentient super-dog slaves. In Eclipse Phase, on the other hand, the only known psychic powers are on a) horrible nano-monsters from space, b) people possessed by horrible nano-monsters from space, and c) escapees from a secret project to raise children to adulthood by putting their brains into accelerated time simulations, giving them 10 subjective years of experiences in the span of 1 year or less. Nobody would ever try to, for example, market products to psychic people, or create a support group for psychic people. In fact, people who round up psychics to conduct studies on them are assassinated at the first sign of doing something so insane. Usually by the players. Psychic powers absolutely defy scientific explanation, even in a world where you can save a backup copy of your fucking brain, then nanofabricate a cyborg and download your brain into it. I’m colorblind so I’m going to change my font. Shades of red/green look horrible to me and sometimes green and yellow look the same. A pet concept of mine completely unrelated to the interplay of science and technology is a world with incredibly massive cultural distance. If you have a race of griffins and a race of catgirls, the two are obviously going to have completely different ways of doing and thinking about just about everything. Either with or without some kind of explanation beyond “well their conditions are different,” I would like to work with the idea of very, very, very different factions. I’m not talking Communist, Anarchist, Fascist, whatever--I’m talking about my idea of a faction using wards instead of buildings, and a faction that’s one big hive mind, and some Asari types who only have one gender. *** Figments Weird Colors!: I’m probably going to suck at explaining myself, so it’ best if I keep this short. Magic is an innate part of certain things. Some people are born with it, others are not. Those that are born with it must constantly release it, otherwise the massive influx of raw power would consume them. Those that aren’t, however, utilize other means to acquire magic. Finding natural “hotspots,” or other such things. Dunno. This is just a raw, possibly unoriginal, concept. Geography Stuffs: River Kingdoms: The cradle of civilization, centred around rivers. Culture reflected in the nature of those rivers (kingdoms around rivers with very random currents believe the gods to be very random and cruel, while a kingdom around a calm and predictable river believe the gods to be a force for order and benevolence). -DP *** General Concept: I like the idea of 3-5 nations being the “major powers” on a given (civilized) continent, with each one under a different kind of government. Athens vs. Sparta vs. Persia vs. Parliamentary England, for example. ALSO ALSO, humans should be the dominant race. MAYBE one or two “alien” nonhuman races, but there should be some purpose behind their existence (also, I am kind of sad that we’re assuming fantasy over scifi, but ah well :<) —GV *** Tactical: I don’t think a compromise is terribly difficult. Magic IN SPACE might actually be a cool idea. Anyone here familiar with Spelljammer? It’s an RPG system in which you fly a magic space pirate ship through space, and sometimes you fight space monsters. Damn it. I should probably lay off this, because at this point I’m on the verge of imposing an idea that only I care about, but: A high-magic, high-tech, interplanetary society that flies Spelljammer vessels is starting to sound like an incredibly hilarious idea. Add alien races and you’ve got something so crazy that it pleases even me. Like, my idea with wards instead of buildings? They do that because it’s the perfect solution for their planet. We’ll also have a kind of dynamic where Quarians and Volus need to wear suits in order to visit other races--not everyone breathes the same type of air. Ship designs. Technology. Trading. And... and magic. Cultural exchange of magic. Wait, this is awesome. And. *click* Astrology-ish, planetary magic. Stars contain fonts of magic that affects the planets around them; everyone who comes close feels the effects and the way magic/culture develops in that system is guided by the star’s particular brand of magic. I wanted Worldsingers to be like this in the first place--totally, unfathomably different societies, such that nobody can visit anyone else without looking out of place and bringing up culture clash--and an interplanetary society provides a reason for that. *** Necro-Empire (WiP name): An empire ruled by an aristocratic class of necromancers, practicing blood magic, offering human(?) sacrifices to a god(?) trapped underground, using the magical energies drawn from those sacrifices to strengthen both itself and his followers, so they might provide him with an even greater number of sacrifices. -DP *** Central Geography: a central feature to a continent that makes it distinct could have any number of things, but for our first continent, I like the idea of a volcano or desert; either can have spiritual/historical significance —GV. For example, a great desert or (to bring up an oldy of mine) the Ashen Wastes. -WB *** Artic region. Appearing desolate to the untrained eye. Frozen landscape. Subject to powerful blizzards. Any plantlife would be hidden away beneath the ice, or thrive near the edges of this region. A yet undiscovered(?) civilization of Griffon culture would exist in the heart of this region. —BR *** Mountain Kingdom: A small, mountainous realm bordering a large, predatory empire, only remaining free due to being the only place in the world with a great supply of this rare metal with which one can make fantastically strong steel. -DP Da Magicks (if we have it): Soul Based: Every creature has a soul or some other form of metaphysical being, which allows for some basic manipulation of the physical reality around them. There is not a strict amount of divisible “energy” which is used during magic use, but rather it is that the entirety of that soul passes through some material aspect of the world in order to alter it in some fasion, much like electricity might pass through a transformer or resistor. Hence, if different creatures have different sizes of power, the larger power would be less precise with his or her casting. The transformation may go both ways, affecting the spiritual realm, the physical realm, or both. —Dos *** Magic is rare, powerful, and awe-inspiring. Not something one would take up on a whim. Magic is a sword without the hilt, often coming at a great price. One kind of magic may be spirit-kindling with animals. A man kindred with his horse may be the greatest rider alive, not needing to direct his horse because it knows the will of his rider, and the rider knows the condition of his horse instinctively. A man kindred with a dog or wolf would benefit from his kindred-wolf’s acute sense of hearing and smell, have it scout or help him hunt. Someone connected with a hawke could see through its eyes, someone with a bat see in the darkness, etc. The cost comes from that the more the “magician” makes use of the bond, the more of the animal’s spirit he possesses. A horse, wolf, or hawke is not the same as a human, and one may eventually lose some of his humanity for that bond. Another kind of magic would be spirit-walking, where the magician walks between himself and other people, talking with them in their minds as if he was there, even if he was a world away. He could see through their eyes, visit their dreams, project images, etc. As one does this, one always risks the chance of losing oneself, however, either in the individual one visits, or in the stream of consciousness (the collective thoughts of mankind) that one has to travel through. May prove addictive, as (after a while) one gets so accustomed to the “music” of the stream, that one always wants to visit it again, even at the detriment of the body one leaves behind... -DP *** Education Based: Magic has laws and rules. Some can be bent, others can be broken. All magic has a single centralized theory, though it can vary wildly in actual execution from country to country and individual to individual. Those of great intellect can learn, with time, how to use another’s magic, though that requires their own magic to either dip in strength and complexity as their minds bend around new concepts/ideals. However, if done right, new magics can be born out of the process that can combine the greatest aspects of both worlds. However, magic done by this method has a terrible price in that it can become “common” does this mean? —GV. As magic grows “common” it becomes weaker so like in the Dresden Files. Where the Wizards gave the Necronomicon to everyone because, if too many people draw on a source of power, it’s “like drawing water through too many faucets”, thus weakening the primary source —GV, due not only to more flippant attitudes on the majesty and power, but the greater drain it places on the nature of magic itself. -WB *** Art/Style-Based (see: Bending/Mistborn): Magic does a certain “thing” associated with a certain object/concept/idea. Its practice is less about restrictions and rules, and more about the possibility of application that comes with imagination. It is not a “school,” though technique and proper use (as opposed to “wild” users) can be taught. —GV it genetic? —Dos like genetic as the “common” way to spread it, though obviously there has to be some ultimate origin —GV *** Magic would be an innate ability for some creatures, while others would need to put in long hours of training to awaken their “spark” Magic also has different style and nature and power based on which creature wields it and which area of the world it lives in. It is spirit driven, and one must understand how it works to manipulate it expand/explain my thoughts on this when they become more clear to me —BR *** Last time I talked magic in Worldsingers, it didn’t really work out, and I’m seeing the same things happen here, so I’ll stand a little bit back from this. My “fonts of magic” idea might apply to a setting that isn’t IN SPACE; perhaps different magic is created by different gods, or perhaps there are several sources of magic in the world, I don’t know. I will say that it was a mistake to try to work out a compromise last time. “soul magic” should be soul magic, and should always stick to the idea of soul magic. Trying to weasel your way out of that so that some jackass can have his idea of vibration-based magic does not work. There has to be a solid-ass idea of what magic is, and that idea has to be consistent. Even if they’re consistently inconsistent, like with my “magic fonts.” Basic World History? Some ancient war/event that everyone knows/fears could happen again. A WWIV, if you will. WWIII almost destroyed the world, and now looms on the distant horizon. Nobody knows who started it, or what exactly happened in it. -WB Most countries have their own disparate/individualized history (think European tribes) that they’ve grown out of into a more “globalized” age. This, right now, is the Age of Great Politics, Treaties, and War. —GV with that ancient history serving as their excuses for not trusting their neighbors. Everyone has someone to blame for that horrible event. -WB *** There is an objective “History,” being what happened in reality spanning up to 1,728 years before, the records of which still lay in the Great Library of some nation, but most cultures have their own oral or other tradition that contradicts this in some manner. What happened before 1,728 years ago, we don’t know, and everyone will give you a different answer. —Dos *** I feel it would be necessary to write out a canon history of all the different cultures and races leading up to the present leading back at least 1,000 if not 5,000 years. It would give story writers an idea of how each nation feels toward each other, and give them the freedom to alter the state of the world through someone’s actions. —BR *** I like migrations. Ethnicities trampling each other out. Clashes of civilizations.--DP *** It is pointless to have this discussion at this phase in planning. Language Language must be representative of the race just english no need to overcomplicate things just yet —GV agree —DosMenar ni att jag inte får använda mina svenska-skillz?--DP, but a central language should be established. -WB {Makes sense—BR] “2l 33t 5u bro #yolo#swag” —King Cassius the Fifth, Master Poet of the Yangkün Technology I like MagiTek, really. Steampunk as a technological theme (relevant to Magitek) works too. I want, ideally, for there to be a logical progression from the (presumably low-tech) society we’re starting with (though hi-tech could be really fun too, assuming that magic is the power source/etc) to a “modern” society and even a “futuristic” one (i.e., even if there’s no such thing as outer space, they should be able to build spaceships at some point and have it be the same world with the same fundamental principles). —GV *** The world is on the cusp of transitioning from basic swords and shields, to perhaps a more mystic technology-based world. Magic has sped dramatically sped up the transition from firing a bow to utilizing firearms than if they had been forced to develop through less mystic means. Also, to reflect the nature of their change, even the warfare now has a strangeness to it. (Think of the American Revolution Era with wizards.) -WB *** I’d like even the “present day” to be relatively low in tech-level. I prefer the medieval fantasy setting (with its own spin to things, of course). Alchemy could be a “thing”, for example. Using potions, alchemists’ fire, repellents, brews, etc. in greater quantity and frequency. The harvesting of organs off of magical creatures could also lend itself to some interesting imagery. -DP *** I think it’s safe to say that modern electronics would be out of the question, but I am open to the idea of magical artifacts ranging from simple light crystals to, say, a hammer that when placed in the center of the throne room, erects a shield around the whole kingdom, which discourages thoughts of violence. The more powerful artifacts would possibly having cultural significance within a region. —BR *** I’m a big, big fan of magitech. I already talked about coporate magical security. Why can’t we go in the opposite direction--instead of discovering magic and doing science to it, we discover math and do magic to it. Locomotives with glowing crystals instead of furnaces. Oxes dragging carts full of magic shit to help the crops grow. Magic shit drawn all over the walls of a building to work as a communication/security network. See, when we talk about “alchemy” and “medieval tech with magic” we’re talking about “let’s be the same as every other fantasy setting ever!” My thought is to consider the idea that society hasn’t invented guns yet, because they figured out how to mass-produce golf balls that turn into fireballs first. -Tac *** Races and Creatures Creatures are more than capable of being fantastic, strange, and sometimes almost inexplicable, but always having some basic grounding in what could, logically, exist in the world. No bats the size of skyscrapers yet with two wings the size of shetland ponies that still somehow manages to fly without either technological or mystical assistance. Races can vary depending on overall location and the environment they have found themselves into. (Perhaps several races are humans that have dramatically altered themselves in order to live in a much harsher environment?) -WB *** Races? Again, keep it to only humans and MAYBE only one or two other sentient races be fine with a couple of stranger races, but I agree that humans should be the main ones —Dos Seconded!--DPmain reasoning behind the portal magic that links to other worlds, some with vastly different races and means of using magic/tech -WB basically Stargate? —GV (so long as their existence serves a purpose—an infamous alchemist’s experiment, for example, or a race of Ancient Aliens). —GV *** I think it’s apparent that I’m going to want griffons. good with any MLP race (except maybe the buffalo) —Dos no griffons. If you really want a nonhuman race, be original—make something from scratch (or at least steal from very obscure mythology —GV :( fine. I’ll create my own winged frost beasts D’oh. Past that, I like the idea of both biped and quadruped races having their own distinct culture. Beasts and small critters can be added later, but they should also be apparent in the universe. Perhaps have a few legendary creatures scattered throughout the realm. —BR *** The stuff that’s being said here is basically a continuous “Tac’s ideas can’t happen” Religion I think different cultures would have differing views on religion. Entire worlds might all worship the same god, while other places would prefer to view practicality over a deity. —BR *** I like the people of the setting to have no more evidence for or against the existence of deities than real-life people do. Plenty of religions, though. Worshipping the nameless spirits of the trees and the wind? Sun-worshippers or death-cultists? Pantheons of dozens of gods, or just the one Great one? Put it all in there!--DP — BR There shouldn’t be a canon pantheon. —Dos (note: Not that there might not be beings of great power around (see “Necro-Empire” above) but how can one be sure if those are gods or not...)-DP *** If a pantheon, keeping it reasonably-sized. No more than about a dozen gods. Possibly not even actually true deities, but instead super-powerful beings from those other worlds. Crystal Dragon Jesus —GVmore like the Fairy Kingdom from Dresden Files -WB *** I really like a more Shinto/Buddhist-style pantheism, with a “respect” for nature or spirits, rather than a full-blown religion. And if we must have a pantheon, no more than 2-4 deities (with dualist symbolism up the wazoo). Dunno what my opinion is on actual existence of said spirits/gods, though I’m definitely leaning toward scientific atheism. —GV The creative freedom to have at least a culture with almost any kind of religion should be maintained, though that does not mean they have to be the majority. I’d be okay with the majority being atheistic or somesuch, as long as there is room for others —Dos *** Actually, there might be something to forbidding us from writing one culture that breaks from the norm as far as religion. If there’s a Greek pantheon of gods out there who actually exist, then having one faction of people who are Buddhists would be out of place. Similarly, if we use the example of soul magic, we should be careful that we don’t end up writing a religion that doesn’t really make sense in a world where souls are totally real. Diversity is okay, but I do not like the idea of just writing an atheist society because atheists are cool. Maybe pointedly diverse would be fun, but that just risks being messy. Having magic, gods, and atheism rubbing shoulders just feels like someone wanted to make a point of having atheists. Same as one character summoning Ifrit to do her bidding, while her buddy doesn’t believe in gods and just likes to meditate. Central Government(Basic unification of the Continent) Primary form perhaps some conglomerate of empires forms the central government? Then, on the outskirts, you have tribes and warlords with deadly magic holding their own with ferocity and cunning. -WB *** I’m seeing a militia based empire try to reach out and gather control over the other nations. Perhaps with certain laws set out, tailored to the individual regions they affect? Then the mages are on an entirely different continent, either holding animosity or neutrality toward this empire which they do not deem a threat. —BR *** I vote for at least one European-style continent (i.e. highly divided and volatile) and at least one near-unified continent (at least where it matters; i.e. the height of Imperial China or the Maya)sounds very akin to my thought of a militia based empire. I like the idea. —BR I would say that the dichotomy (Volatility vs Stability) would be a good one, and the land-masses could even be connected (See Europe/Asia or North America/South America) —Dos Power/Warfare Magic, not technology or strength of arms, is the central theory of warfare. Those countries with the most mages, and the strongest magics, often hold the most power. Armies are usually mere support for the mages, bodies they can throw at each other as they prepare their most deadly magics for use. -WB me of the Inheritance series (Eragon) —BR *** It is pointless to have this discussion at this phase in planning. Overarching Feel of the World Overall, I want it to be hopeful. Perhaps some unrest some political maneuvering, but I don’t really want a Lovecraftian feel. If we go with “high-tech magical portal civilization,” I want a Golden Age (Star Trek) kind of feel. If we go with GoT/LotR-level society, then probably something closer to what Mr. Blue Text is writing, though Status Quo is probably closer to what I want than “On the brim of World War I.” —GV which feels about as stable as Victorian England/Gilded Age America, perhaps? I do agree that it should be hopeful, generally, but there is room for war and there is room for peace —Dos *** Tension. The feeling of uncertainty as alliances form and break, nobody knowing what will drive the world into its next, and likely final, Great War. Overall like the Cold War. -WB *** I think we should create a mostly neutral ground for the world to exist in. It should be up to the story teller if the world is at peace or in turmoil. Or it could simply be everything at once. Some places are at war while others are at peace. *** I like a grey vs. grey, or even dark vs. grey or dark vs. dark, kind of world, where not every story has a happy ending. Still, most do, but it’s really a matter of earning that happy ending. In any case, no clear cut light vs. dark setting with an absolute good and bad side, please. Add some moral complexity to it.--DP of Throooooooooones —GV a leaf from Hayao Miyazaki. Not everyone or everything is good or evil, but everything must work to protect the balance of darkness and light. —BR [http://www.coolandgeek.com/the-flawed-concept-of-good-vs-evil/ http://www.coolandgeek.com/the-flawed-concept-of-good-vs-evil/] can have their own conception of what is “good” or “bad,” but the world-at-large, to the outsider, should have a grey vs. grey feeling (I’m hesitant to advocate for dark vs. dark, as that leaves little room for hope and joy) —Dos *** Already said my piece something like three times. Let me know if I’m still wanted. The Hayao Miyazaki comment is a very astute one. Princess Mononoke is a good example. The villain has clear motives, including in moments where she’s being “evil.” Princess Mononoke definitely has a Good side (Prince Ashitaka), but that good is interesting and nuanced (Ashitaka is an alien, San is a wild child who seriously hates humans, the forest gods are weird and wild and kinda scary). Far more importantly, there is no “evil.” So Princess Mononoke is a rather light shade of grey vs grey. A more neutral or dark kind of grey vs grey goes along the same principles. My thought is that we should always keep such things in mind when designing factions. Design a race of happy multicolored ponies, but give them some weird traits, like making them childlike and naive, a bunch of pushovers who think that everyone runs on the same power of friendship. Do not make proud warrior Saiyans. Do not make quiet, meditative elves. If you do, think about how those people might be a little more nuanced.